As the co-founder of , an educational technology startup focused on improving the mental health outcomes of school communities, Thadani expanded the coaching and curriculum offered to all frontline members 鈥� from bus drivers to cafeteria workers to sanitation staff.

鈥淧art of Robin鈥檚 platform is coaching, developing connections, building resilience and really understanding the skillsets you need to deal with life’s challenges,鈥� Thadani told 蜜桃影视. 鈥淪o if we’re going to do a great job with students, we have to do an unbelievable job with all the adults in their lives.鈥�

For Thadani, destigmatizing conversations around mental health hits home.

As a young parent, Thadani met a father from Newtown, Connecticut who opened up to him about losing his 7-year-old son in a school shooting.

That father was Mark Barden, the co-founder and CEO of the , a nonprofit organization dedicated to preventing gun violence in schools.

Touched by Barden鈥檚 passion to protect children, Thadani began volunteering for the organization 鈥� which later served as the catalyst for co-founding Robin.

鈥淎s I learned more about what they’re doing, I took a look at how mental health has affected my own family and close friends,鈥� Thadani said. 鈥淚 took that as a sign and inspiration to say I’m going to do something about it.鈥�

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

蜜桃影视: I understand that your affiliation with Sandy Hook Promise played a large role in the creation of Robin. Walk me through how your volunteer work led to starting an educational technology startup.

I’m so proud and feel very fortunate to the team I met over at Sandy Hook Promise. It was a couple years ago and I just so happened to have a conversation with . I didn’t really know who he was at that very moment, but later found out as he shared his story with me that he鈥檚 not only a parent who lost his 7-year-old that day, but also happened to be one of the co-founders of Sandy Hook Promise. 

We took a liking to each other and had a lovely conversation. He shared some of his goals, ambitions, and the story of that day with me. As a young parent at the time, it really shook me to my core. I asked him how I can help and he shared with me some of the things that I could do. So I became a and started helping them in any way I could from volunteering to fundraising.

A lot of people talk about the gun violence prevention policy work they do, which is absolutely incredible, but a bulk of what they do that really makes a large impact is the mental health programs for kids. They have two very well known programs called and . When I learned more about these programs, and talked to Mark and Nicole and the rest of the team, I thought wow this is incredible and I wish this was everywhere. We started talking about how much of a challenge it is to reach every school in America and get this program out there. Sandy Hook Promise is a nonprofit doing wonderful things but they only have so much reach. 

As I learned more about what they’re doing, I took a look at how mental health has affected my own family and close friends. I took that as a sign and inspiration to say I’m going to do something about it. What I鈥檝e learned is that there aren鈥檛 a lot of preventive and proactive programs out there that are making an impact. So that鈥檚 just some of the genesis on why myself and Scott and now a larger team started Robin.

I understand that Robin extends resources to all frontline members of school communities, such as bus drivers, cafeteria workers and sanitation staff. Tell me more about this initiative.

As any young company, you can only do so much right out of the gates. We started creating this digital online curriculum for students starting with middle school and high school and then eventually elementary. As we were out there talking to principals and superintendents and counselors, I started learning that not only was there not much for educators but they also weren’t really thinking about it in a more broad frame.

As we started to talk to more people, we realized, wait a minute, it’s not just teachers who are interacting every day with students. It鈥檚 the cafeteria worker, it鈥檚 the bus driver, it鈥檚 the crossing guard. If you think about it, the bus driver is the first person to see our kids and the last person to drop them off. They have the potential to set the tone for the day based on how they鈥檙e doing.

With one school in upstate New York, we had the opportunity to talk to their leadership team at a conference. They talked about some of the challenges that their transportation team was facing. It’s tough being a driver and having a group of students screaming or yelling or being rambunctious on the bus. In addition to administrators, unions and parents that can be challenging at times. Who’s supporting and allowing them the space and opportunity to talk to someone? Part of Robin鈥檚 platform is coaching, developing connections, building resilience and really understanding the skillsets you need to deal with life’s challenges. So if we’re going to do a great job with students, we have to do an unbelievable job with all the adults in their lives.

So we began this journey to support all frontline members starting with this one school in upstate New York who gave us the opportunity to talk to their transportation team. We did a six part coaching series with all 18 of them and asked them about the challenges they face in day-to-day work. I’m proud to report that after we finished, everybody retained their jobs, came back to school and walked in with their heads held high. This is something we’re doing now all over the country, from upstate New York to South Carolina to our backyard here in New York City. We’re supporting school communities and I think this is really critical in order to create something sustainable and have long-term impact.

Oftentimes these frontline members of school communities come from diverse and low-income backgrounds. How does Robin ensure the coaching and resources provided to them are not only accessible but also culturally relevant?

It starts with where the content and curriculum comes from. Robin comes from a diverse set of coaches, teachers, counselors and social workers that are not only mental health experts but are also from those communities and have worked in those schools we serve. The largest community we serve is in our backyard in New York City 鈥� the Bronx. A lot of students and families in the Bronx come from lower income communities. They also happen to be from Black and Brown communities where a lot of them don’t speak English. So starting with some of the basics, we have all of our content up in Spanish with closed captions available. Especially for our older students, we make sure that when they see our content not only do they see someone that looks like them or has been through similar challenges, but also in a language they can understand. 

The other thing that Robin does is really listen to the school communities we serve. No school is, of course, the same, even within New York City. The school down the street might have a separate set of challenges, opportunities and needs then the next. I think part of the reason schools are not only coming to us but coming back to us is because we are a reflection of who they are. And again, while we can’t be everything to everyone, we are pulling from a lot of different types of communities and trying to really understand what those communities are asking for. In turn, we can address them with the right sets of curriculum or coaches that they not only want to hear from, but based on the data and some of our surveys and some of our processes, is the right fit for their particular community. So it’s a little bit of a combination of using technology and data and good old fashioned listening skills to really understand the communities we serve and what they’re particularly going through.

In the wake of the Nashville school shooting, what is something about gun violence prevention more school communities need to talk about?

I happened to be in Tennessee about an hour southeast of Nashville visiting one of the schools we work with when this occurred. So I’m with the superintendent of this district and we, of course, talked about it. There are signs out there for these particular students, whether they were posting on social media or showing signs that they were stressed or angry. These students or graduates had no outlet or connection and felt an element of loneliness. And again, these are all studies that have been proven and shown out there in terms of who decides to do these horrific things. 

I think one thing schools all ought to do is understand what those things are so they could be on the lookout. How can we all be armed with information and knowledge on how to notice these signs and then know what to do? How do we get involved sooner and understand what the challenges or issues that a particular student or set of students are facing right now? I think all schools want to do that but they don鈥檛 know how to do that. They’re not trained, for example, to know the science. They’re not trained in mental health first aid. 

You bring up a valuable point in regards to mental health training. Tell me more about why it鈥檚 important for school communities to destigmatize conversations around mental health.

When we heard back from schools, they鈥檙e looking for this training. Not specifically training tailored to know how to identify a school shooter. That is very targeted and there are things out there for that. But how to better understand when you see a student of yours that might be going through a mental health challenge and how to help that student in the moment 鈥� from a simple panic attack to an anxiety attack. We do a course around test anxiety. March was SATs and ACTs in a large part of the country, and many students, and parents frankly, get really anxious and nervous. 

There are things we could do to support them in advance of that. That’s sort of the preventative nature of what we’re talking about at Robin. How do we get ahead of these things because we don’t know what life’s challenges or what mental health challenges a student may or may not face. We do know that there are skill sets to put in place today at a young age, even starting in elementary school, that will give them the ability to use those skills if and when a challenge large or small arises.

How have conversations today around gun violence prevention and mental health shaped your own views on the matter?

I look at this from the lens of a parent first and foremost. That’s my number one job and my number one responsibility. It’s made me hyper aware of the possibility that this could happen anywhere and anytime. So what does that mean for young kids growing up? It means we need to make sure they鈥檙e okay talking about it. My daughter came home, she’s in second grade, and she had her first formal active shooter drill. For me, I’m 43 and I grew up in the 80s and 90s. We had fire drills and 鈥渟top, drop and roll鈥� and how to evacuate the building and things of that nature. But our kids are only going to know this world. Having an open conversation with them as a parent so they can understand why we do these things is important. Whether I like to or want to, this is what we have to do. 

It’s also made me want to change this. Whether it鈥檚 through Robin or through supporting Sandy Hook or through just me as an individual doing interviews and podcasts and having these conversations. I know people turn it into a political and divided commentary, but it shouldn’t be. We don’t have all the answers. I don’t have the magic answer in my pocket right now. I have elements of the answer that I think will help, but we need a lot of people to come to the table from all walks of life to solve this. Because you can’t tell me one person who doesn’t want to solve it. We need to come to the table and realize that our kids are literally dying through suicide, gun violence and other medical and mental health issues that lead to some scary things. 

Again, as a parent of young kids going through school for the next decade, this is something I always think about. I don’t necessarily think about it daily or act like this is the last time I鈥檒l see my kids. But for the parents who lost their child, that’s what happened to them. 

For now, I’m so proud of this generation of students and leaders that are bringing this to the forefront of their schools, principals, superintendents and mental health clubs. I do believe this is changing because of the students in this generation that are raising their hands and saying we need to solve this problem.

By that point, the 18-year-old perpetrator had already killed 19 fourth-graders and two teachers. The decision to wait, state law enforcement officials announced on Friday, was made by the head of the Uvalde school district鈥檚 small, six-person police department. Now, as the initial accounting has been retracted and a far more damning narrative has emerged about the officers鈥� response, they鈥檝e come under fierce criticism for the delay in storming the classroom. 

Squarely in the middle of that is the Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District Police Department and its chief, Pedro 鈥淧ete鈥� Arredondo, now into their handling of the deadly incident. School district police departments, in particular their training, capabilities and readiness to confront lethal threats, are being scrutinized like never before and a long-running debate about the harms and benefits of campus cops has reignited. 

Schools have bolstered the ranks of armed school officers in the last several decades 鈥� largely in response to mass school shootings like the one that unfolded in Uvalde. Police now have a presence in about 43 percent of public K-12 schools and the Texas massacre 鈥� despite what appears to be disastrous decision-making on their part 鈥� could further accelerate the trend. Just hours after the Uvalde gunman was neutralized, Sen. Ted Cruz, Republican of Texas, argued that campus cops are best positioned to stop mass school shootings, stating that 鈥渨e know from past experiences that the most effective tool for keeping kids safe is armed law enforcement on the campus.鈥� 

Yet beyond the anecdotes of heroic cops who successfully saved students from being killed and of officers who failed to live up to their sworn duty to protect innocent lives, research on their efficacy remains mixed. Whether they鈥檙e helpful when someone shows up to campus with a gun remains elusive. 

As districts nationwide respond to the Uvalde shooting, they should be cautious when adding new officers to schools to prevent future attacks, said Lucy Sorensen, an assistant professor of public administration and policy at the University of Albany, SUNY, who studies school policing. While school shootings are tragic and politically galvanizing, they remain statistically rare. But officers鈥� daily presence in schools, she said, could carry negative implications for students 鈥� particularly Black youth, who are more likely to be thrust into the school-to-prison pipeline.

鈥淲e鈥檝e seen this in response to prior shootings 鈥� Columbine, Sandy Hook 鈥� where there is this push to harden schools, to add more police officers, add more guns, and the efficacy of these investments is not well established at this point,鈥� Sorensen said, adding that the costs of a full-time police presence in schools could outweigh the advantages. School leaders and lawmakers, she said, 鈥渘eed to think hard about whether this is the right investment or whether it鈥檚 a reactionary investment.鈥� 

Last year, Sorensen concluded in a report that having an officer on campus 鈥渕arginally increases the likelihood of a school shooting,鈥� and suggested that officers failed to prevent school shootings and other gun-related incidents. Yet upon further review of the underlying federal data, she backtracked. In an interview Tuesday with 蜜桃影视, Sorensen said she has now reached a markedly different conclusion. While firearm-related incidents including weapons possession were more frequent in schools with police, the finding could be the result of officers successfully detecting and responding to campus gun incidents. 

鈥淭his could be an actual increase in gun violence, but we think it鈥檚 more being driven by an increase in the detection and reporting of guns that鈥檚 happening from police in schools,鈥� she said. If school-based officers are able to identify and confiscate guns from students that would have otherwise remained in their possession, she said it鈥檚 鈥渓ikely a good thing if it potentially prevents gun violence.鈥� 

Still, a separate report offers caution. Once mass school shootings occur, researchers at the nonprofit Violence Project found that officers may be ineffective at preventing bloodshed. In an analysis of school shootings over four decades 鈥� a total 133 incidents 鈥�  researchers found that fatalities were three times higher in attacks where an armed guard was present compared to those that unfolded without a security presence. Because the perpetrators of mass shootings are often suicidal, researchers speculate that the perpetrators could even be drawn to places with armed security. 

George Floyd鈥檚 murder at the hands of a Minneapolis police officer in 2020 led some school districts to cut ties with the police before COVID-era student behavioral challenges prompted some to reverse course. Through it all, a , according to a recent Education Week survey. Among them is Jake Heibel, the principal of Great Mills High School in Maryland, which suffered a school shooting in 2018. In that incident, a 17-year-old student shot two classmates, one fatally, before taking his own life. The shooting ended when the gunman fatally shot himself as a school resource officer simultaneously shot him in the hand.聽

The school officer鈥檚 actions 鈥渃ertainly saved lives that day and we鈥檙e eternally grateful,鈥� Heibel said in an interview after the Uvalde shooting. 鈥淗e did what he needed to do to protect others and he certainly did that day.鈥澛�

鈥楾he wrong decision, period鈥�

In the immediate aftermath of the Uvalde shooting, the responding officers as 鈥渉eroic鈥� and 鈥渃ourageous,鈥� but the tenor shifted after more information became publicly known. Turns out a school-based cop did not engage the shooter before he entered the school, but one was there: He responded to the scene but drove past the gunman as he crouched down next to a car in the parking lot, officials said.

On Friday, that Chief Arredondo, of the Uvalde school district police department, was the incident commander who ordered officers to stand back instead of storming the Robb Elementary School classroom where fourth-graders and educators were locked inside with the gunman. Officials said that Arredondo believed erroneously that the shooter was barricaded inside the classroom and that students鈥� lives were no longer at risk. Ultimately a tactical team of Border Patrol agents , opened the classroom door using a janitor鈥檚 keys and fatally shot the gunman. 

鈥淔rom the benefit of hindsight, where I鈥檓 sitting now, of course it was not the right decision,鈥� Texas Department of Public Safety Director Steven McCraw said during a Friday press conference. 鈥淚t was the wrong decision, period. There was no excuse for that.鈥� 

Arredondo鈥檚 decision to wait has faced similar rebukes from proponents of school-based policing, including school security consultant Kenneth Trump, president of the Cleveland-based National School Safety and Security Services. Prior to the notorious 1999 school shooting at Columbine High School in suburban Denver, standard law enforcement procedures called on police to secure the scene鈥檚 perimeter and call in the SWAT team. But Columbine 鈥渃ompletely changed that,鈥� Trump said, and in recent decades officers are trained to respond to the threat immediately, even if they鈥檙e alone on the scene. 

After the 2018 mass school shooting in Parkland, Florida, which resulted in 17 deaths, the school resource officer stationed at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, Scot Peterson, was charged with criminal negligence after he failed to engage the gunman. While Trump said that Peterson became Parkland鈥檚 鈥渟econd-biggest villain,鈥� after the shooter, he said the law enforcement response in Uvalde was far worse.

鈥淗ere you have numerous people who, it would appear, did not follow the best practice for the last two decades,鈥� Trump said.  

For Blaine Gaskill, the school resource officer who rushed to stop the armed student at Maryland鈥檚 Great Mills High School in 2018, the fear of losing his own life didn鈥檛 even cross his mind. In fact, he told 蜜桃影视, 鈥淚 didn鈥檛 feel anything.鈥� 

鈥淚 had a job to do and I did it,鈥� he said in an email Friday.  Though Gaskill declined to comment on the Texas shooting, he expressed support for campus police, saying they 鈥減lay a big role in preventing any tragedy.鈥� 

鈥淛ust our presence alone makes students, parents and staff feel safer,鈥� he said. 鈥淲e have the ability to respond to any incident very quickly, whether it鈥檚 an active threat or a fight in the school. We are seconds away from stopping or intervening in any incident.鈥� 

In fact, instruction on a quick response had been provided to officers at the 4,100-student Uvalde school district, which despite its small size maintains its own police force and an , including 鈥渢hreat assessment鈥� teams, a visitor management system that limits access to school buildings and a digital surveillance tool that sifts through social media posts in search of violent threats. In December, Arredondo completed an active-shooter training course that taught participants how to distinguish an active shooting from 鈥渁 hostage or barricade crisis.鈥� Just two months ago, on how to respond to an active shooting. The training was based on materials by the Texas Commission on Law Enforcement, according to The New York Times, which inform officers they may need to put themselves in harm’s way and 鈥渄isplay uncommon acts of courage to save the innocent.鈥� 

鈥淎s first responders we must recognize that innocent life must be defended,鈥� according to the training materials. 鈥淎 first responder unwilling to place the lives of the innocent above their own safety should consider another career field.鈥�     

While Arredondo served as the incident commander, Trump questioned whether his small campus police department was equipped for an emergency of this scale. Many school district police departments lack tactical training, he said, and often defer to larger agencies following major incidents.

鈥淲hen you form an incident command structure, there is nothing that says that the initial incident commander on scene cannot pass that torch to the representative of another agency, a tactical team that may have more expertise, experience and tactical knowledge,鈥� Trump said. 鈥淚t can be done. You can pass the torch.鈥�

Why that didn鈥檛 happen, and which department was responsible for released right after the shooting, remains unclear. 

While Trump maintained support for campus cops, proponents of police-free schools said that police shortcomings in Uvalde speak to the policy arguments they鈥檝e been making for years. Among them is Maria Fernandez, managing director of campaign strategy at the Advancement Project, a racial justice group. A national movement to remove police from schools landed major policy victories after Floyd鈥檚 murder, but the political tides shifted back in favor of policing as students returned to schools during the pandemic and educators reported an uptick in classroom disruptions. The Uvalde shooting is proof that the strategy doesn鈥檛 work, Fernandez said. 

鈥淭he narrative that is so entrenched in our communities is that police equals safety or that they can stop the evil that is moving outside of the school door 鈥� and that鈥檚 not what happened and they lied about it,鈥� she said. The school district was served by its own police department, 鈥渉ardened鈥� security measures, a municipal police department that receives about and federal Border Patrol agents. It all failed to save 21 innocent lives. 

鈥淭his is our nightmare,鈥� Fernandez said. 鈥淲e know for a fact that police don鈥檛 actually generate safety in the face of incredible violence. It鈥檚 just so devastating that this had to happen.鈥�

Shootings bolster school policing

The attack in Uvalde is the deadliest mass school shooting in nearly a decade. In 2012, the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in Newtown, Connecticut, resulted in the deaths of 20 children and six educators. If history tells us anything, the Uvalde shooting will precede a rash of local and federal spending on campus policing. 

In 2013, a noted a limited body of research on the effectiveness of school resource officers, stating flatly that existing reports did 鈥渘ot address whether their presence in schools has deterred mass shootings.鈥� Yet the Sandy Hook tragedy 鈥� and the 2018 mass school shooting in Parkland, Florida 鈥� led to an infusion of local and federal money for school-based policing. In the last several decades, the federal government has spent roughly $1 billion to station police in schools. Responding to shootings with school policing and beefed-up security reflects the country鈥檚 鈥渘eoliberal approach to solving social problems,鈥� said Benjamin Fisher, an assistant professor of criminal justice at Florida State University whose research focuses on campus policing. 

鈥淩ather than talking about the one thing that all school shootings have in common 鈥� which is the presence of a gun 鈥� we are instead focusing on how to make schools different in some way. We鈥檙e putting the problem on schools rather than on gun access and availability.鈥�

Since Sandy Hook, researchers have scrutinized the role that police play in schools, and in some cases have found , including an increase in student discipline for low-level offenses and a drop in high school graduation and college enrollment rates. Research has found that the negative outcomes are particularly dire for Black students, who are disproportionately subjected to campus arrests.

In her more recent research, Sorensen of the University of Albany, SUNY, found that placing officers in schools leads to an increase in campus safety, but at a great cost to students 鈥� particularly those who are Black. The research, which relies on figures from , found that officers effectively combat some forms of campus violence including fights, but their presence also correlates with an increase in student suspensions, expulsions and arrests. Students, especially those who are disabled, are chronically absent more when campuses are staffed by cops, she found. 

The research isn鈥檛 yet peer-reviewed. In fact, it was during the peer-review process that researchers identified a problem, Sorensen said. The Civil Rights Data Collection relies on every school in the U.S. to self-report data on a range of student outcomes and has long been criticized for including inaccuracies. For example, districts have been accused of underreporting campus arrests and instances of sexual misconduct. 

When researchers triangulated the federal data on school shootings against news reports, they found that the rate of school shootings appeared to have been overreported, which Sorensen said could be the result of an administrative data error. As a result of unreliable data, she said it remains unclear whether campus cops have any effect on the likelihood of a school shooting. 

Still, Sorensen said that the negative outcomes of school policing, like the student suspensions, 鈥渁ren鈥檛 costless.鈥� 

鈥淓very child who gets killed in a school shooting is too much, it鈥檚 too many kids,鈥� she said, yet such tragedies remain statistically rare and most communities will never have to experience what Uvalde just endured. 鈥淚 do think it鈥檚 important to weigh more heavily the day-to-day impacts of having police officers in schools and what those costs and benefits are.鈥�

The risk of 鈥榗herry-picking鈥� anecdotes 

As the apparent police failures in Uvalde and officers鈥� delayed response are dissected, Mo Canady, executive director of the National Association of School Resource Officers, said in this situation, the officers may have simply been outgunned. 

School resource officers are generally equipped with handguns, while the gunman reportedly carried out the attack with an AR-15-style assault rifle. Campus police should have the same equipment as cops assigned to patrol the streets, Canady said, but added that his group is 鈥渘ot involved in politics around the gun debate.鈥� 

鈥淗ere鈥檚 what I know: If gun sales stopped today, there are still millions of guns out in our society, that鈥檚 just a fact鈥� he said. 鈥淪o we have to continue to prepare to defend our communities, which for us is our schools, against the potential for these types of attacks and the potential for us to be outgunned.鈥� 

Even as some districts have equipped campuses with rifles and gun safes, he questioned whether that was an effective solution. 

鈥淗ere鈥檚 the thing, unless you鈥檙e sitting in that office or right next to it, you鈥檙e not going to waste precious seconds to go get the long gun when there鈥檚 someone killing babies,鈥� he said. 鈥淭hat is a dynamic that is very difficult to resolve.鈥� 

To bolster his argument, Canady pointed to multiple tragedies where the responses by school-based police were credited with saving lives. In March, for example, administrators at a Kansas high school called an officer to help them search a . When the officer arrived, the student removed a gun from his bag and shot both the officer and a school administrator. The officer, who has since been described as a hero, returned fire and struck the student. All three survived. 

Meanwhile Trump, the school security expert, said it鈥檚 important to consider school shootings that may have been prevented due to a police presence on campus. Despite a lack of research, he pointed to anecdotes where officers identified students with weapons and uncovered concrete plans to kill. Yet anecdotes also exist of officers failing to uphold their duties. 

Fisher, the criminal justice researcher, said there鈥檚 reason to be cautious of anecdotal evidence in place of scientific research because it 鈥渞isks cherry-picking.鈥�

鈥淎necdotes allow us to craft a narrative because we don鈥檛 have to subject our beliefs to systematic and reproducible inquiry,鈥� he said. 鈥淲e can pick the pieces of evidence that we want 鈥� and that鈥檚 on both sides of the argument.鈥�